As the title of this thread states:

I think we are seeing the death of 25 man Raiding!
On average, since WoTLK only 20% of the 25 man guilds have survived to this date, whilst active 10 man guilds have grown.


So - What is wrong with 25 man raiding?
Most people who raided 25 man did so because originally, 25 man was the hardest content in the game. The desire to "Be the best" motivated them to raid. There was respect for the 25 man raider. Since Cata - This has dissapeared and most 25 man raiders have quit the game.

I will say now that the death of 25 man does not have anything to do with 10 man guilds in general. I am actually happy for 10 man guilds who progress and enjoy it. That is fine. But the way Blizz has set it up has meant that the 10 man expeirnece has taken away what is special about 25 man.

The very fact 25 man DOES NOT HAVE its own achievement, means that blizz feels that 10 man and 25 man is the same.

This is a joke. One of the things 10 man guilds and 25 man guilds agree on is that the raiding experience is TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

If i am a 25 man raider I compete with other 25 man guilds on my realms or others. I actually don't even look at 10 man progression because imo and "In their opinion" we are raiding two completely separate things.

If 25 man had its own achievement, it actually makes 25 man guilds have a goal. 25 man can have its own community because right now, the 10 man experience takes away from 25 man.

Comparisons about the difficulty or loot distrubution of 10 and 25 man is all irrelevant, so any discussions on that is needless. What blizz needs to do is accept that 10 and 25 man raiding is different, and cater for our needs seperatley

At the very least us 25 man guilds need our own achievement. 10 man guilds wont be angry with us having our own achievement and it will mean that 25 man guilds can have their own targets and own glory. That is all we really want as raiders, the chance to be the best in what we do.